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That 6-Slot Hero in General Discussion.GENGHIS. Which hero, do you think, if gets sixslotted, is the most difficult to win against?

Which hero, do you think, if gets six_slotted, is the most difficult to win against?

1. Naga Siren
2. Medusa
3. Anti-Mage
4. Spectre
5. Phantom Lancer
6. Phantom Assassin
7. Or, you have someone else in mind?

Please, name only one hero so we can see which hero gets most of our votes for being the troublesome among them all.

6 slotted pa is not a threat. i would add slark instead.

actually, its very hard to win against 6 slotted naga, which is kinda balanced by the fact that core naga is super useless early on.

@Triple, Agreed. I've actually put these heroes in order of the most difficult to least difficult, to me. Naga Siren being the most difficult one. When she gets her 6 slots, I already know that team has won.

A good PA player is still a pain-in-arse though, but Silver Edge has really nerfed her threat.

+ for Slark tip. Although, he could be caught out late game if enemy team has Scythe of Vyse.

@KappaStorm I would replace 12 slotted LD with 6 slotted Morphing in terms of being troublesome. But, is 12 slotted LD even viable nowadays?

6 slotted pl loses a 1v1 fight to average 6 slotted timbersaw
6 slotted antimage, if he doesnt get 6 slots at 35 mins, gets locked down pretty easily
6 slotted medusa is close to be unkillable but terribly lacks mobility
6 slotted spectre is one of the most scary things in the game, but she can still be killed
6 slotted slark is best 1v1 fighter in the game, but hes not as good in 5v5 teamfights as spectre
6 slotted naga siren is cancer that doesnt let you leave highground for more than 15 seconds, but she cant fight

ye morphling is super cancerous too. and void (although not against spectre, slark, and naga siren)

@spunkifol
the fact that im russian doesnt mean that ld is my mom.
his bear is my mom, and ld is my dad, its fucking obvious

Medusa is kinda hard to kill 6 slotted, mb a good morph can rat efficiently and is hard to kill/sick dmg.
am gets outcarried by other carries unless he is ahead and/or splitpushing.
slark is incredible with 6 slots if 3 of them consist of bkb/abyssal/refresher

AM tbh. Because when he gets six-slotted, you know your carry is working on his 3rd item.

6 slotted arc warden. Gl every getting out of base vs that fucker, any fight you take will result in a lost rax. Naga is really close second.

When you word it that way, most difficult to win against, it has to be some sort of rat hero like that right? It's pretty impossible to beat a good arc warden super late game. Nature's prophet, lycan, tb, even tiny and luna can make your life miserable.

If you word it as strongest 6 slotted hero that's a totally different tale.

Naga Siren
While I think Medusa is the harder carry, and will in a matchup, I have to say Naga is more difficult to win against once she has her items. Against Medusa you can possibly stall her and rat. Against Naga, she's in every lane hitting all of your rax at the same time and if she cant beat you in a fight, she can put your team to sleep in one lane while she kills your other two sets of rax. Unless you have 3 heroes who can fight away Naga illusions and possibly 4 other heroes by themselves, its hopeless. So yeah, good 6-slotted Naga is most difficult to win against.

@TripleSteal- 12 slotted LD isnt shit if you build the heroe like a naga and you have aghs :P
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2047075708

Naga and Spectre are the hardest heroes to win against in ultra late scenario (if played properly)

Spectre lategame can tp to base and use haunt, reality, leave illusions, reality to fountain, RO from stash, haunt again, die in tf, buyback swap an item by divine or abyssal and travels 2 again to fight... gamebreaking tier. shes not limited to 6 slots

Naga lategame is a beast in tf if you MICRO properly and is the hardest split pusher, you cant ask more from a hard carry, and she can keep RO in stash to tp base refresh all skills/items and tp again with no delay, also one of the better buyback heroes

@wonder wiater
bear is still very weak against physical burst of any kind or massive nukes. hes like 1 single naga's illusion with 2 mins cd which is not any good.

@Hatsune Miku that never happens, and a lets say you have a position 1 350 duel damage lategame feed LC is ez to outcarry anyways cause shes not a carry after all you duel and kill someone and you die after and this shit happens in half of LC games you main this hero you know man :P
I never saw a LC with more than 400 duel damage, but i get 6 slotted as naga in 90% of my games ;)
Silencer with 600 stolen int will do the job, but you have seen that in a real match?

@TripleSteal- yeah its true but youre exaggerating :P, i play naga and a 6 slotted bear is tankier and faster than a illusion he has cc, he can tp to lanes and he can demolish towers in seconds, you cant ignore him as you maybe can ignore a naga illusion hitting buildings.
Anyways naga is stronger than a 12 slotted LD

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^ do uknow wats a 6 dlotted lc looks like, late game lc ends duel in like 2-4 hits either carry or support.

@Vlad, When I see refresher on Slark, I actually commend that player.

@Sam, True Story.

@Maverick, Agreed. One of Naga's dialogues is: 'The Great Disabler comes!' I think she meant The Great Cancer.

@WonderWaiter, Your profile picture and heroes page is self-explanatory and completely resonates with this topic. Cheers.

@DireWolf, the most difficult to win against -- can be strong, can be rat. + for Arc Warden tip.

@Miku, Still not sold on LC as 6-slotted because her inventory options are diversely versatile and sometimes we don't know if those items were right choice. But, fearsome, still.

TB, morph, sniper.

When i see 6 slot sniper with rapier i might just abandon unless we have some sick gapcloser like Clock or we already got some lane of barracks so we can smoke in their base and catch him. OR gyro with refresher rapier idk.

alchemist not because he is particularly stronk when he is 6 slotted, but rather because he is 6 slotted at 25 min. WTF alchemist, that is too much farm, heroes don't normally grow that fast. He must be a product of Monsanto.

btw morph>spectre, not naga tho cuz that shit pushes all your lanes and u cant do shit unless u kill her

A 6 slotted LC still has a problem with multiple cores with bashes unless massively ahead and with 300+ bonus damage. Medusa, though, can stand her ground even if she's on equal grounds.

triple rustard is there a thread where you dont talk horse shit? if there is send the link

pft 6 slotted sniper has so many counters, he can D high ground extremely well but anything else depends on his team protecting him. Anything with a blink + stun and then dps to blow him up before he can bkb and he'll die. Like tide blink ravage, necro aghs ult follow up, or sand king ult in, zeus ult follow up or wk blink stun, sf blink ult follow up, or just troll blink, bash him to death. Catch my drift? The snipers that end up killing your entire team are always cus they're protected by disablers. A sniper on a team with bb, tide and earth shaker for example is impossible to kill.

'A sniper on a team with bb, tide and earth shaker for example is impossible to kill.'

Because BKBs don't exist?

Dunno, I really love how 2k shittards build sniper, they can get six slotted, but that means they have mjollnir, deso, mkb and daedalus, so you just jump blademail and murder them with lc, that's kinda why the most terrifying 6 slotted heroes are not those that burst you down incredibly fast, but those who can survive every fucking thing you throw at them, like spec and medusa.

Are you implying I build glass cannon snipers? Even with skadi, dominator, s&y, sniper can be bursted down. He is scary but not as scary as medusa and spectre.

Weird that Slark isn't on that list, Slark would SHIT on Phantom Assassin, even if he was 5 slotted, and she was 6 slotted.

Sniper as well shouldn't even be ANYWHERE on that list, a 5 slot Slark can shit on him. Slark can easily close the distance with Dark pact and pounce, especially with blink and shadow blade. The moment Slark gets in his face with the abyssl blade (a 6 slot slark will definitely have this item) + Skadi slow + Sniper shit move speed, he's done.

'Are you implying I build glass cannon snipers? Even with skadi, dominator, s&y, sniper can be bursted down. He is scary but not as scary as medusa and spectre.'

No, I am referring to my games (or at least, how they used to be on my 1.2k up to around 2.2k range) where people pick sniper in a shitty draft and build fucking glass canon without any escape, or with a shadowblade rofl.

My team was holding me back that game doesn't count.

Tb is good but not the rat pusher he once was so if you win team fight you can win. Not like Naga.

Sven isn't that good, he either two shots your entire team or gets kited to death.

Shout out to chaos knight though, he's just too dependent on that ult with a huge cool down. But ck with boots, manta, couple hearts, skadi, ac, that's a lot of fucking illusion dmg

no ember spirit ??????? hes the hardest hero to win against when 6 sloted
but if u want me to chose between mentioned heros its naga siren no dope

six slotted slark with refresher can win anybody

nobody can fucking answer 2x shadow dance

Enigma with Radiance, Scepter and refresher (+bkb, boots and dagger) can kill entire team. Beware of the bh cast animation though after casting refresher.

What is gonna Ember do in a fight? SoF then be useless for 5 seconds?

Also he is way to squishy. Abyssal=dead. Hex=dead.

@Yorkey

Thats why i said, if you hadn't break highground already is hard to win against sniper. Ok you have slark. So wat you gonna do? Dark pact+ ulti just to reach him? Maybe even bkb if they have ground targeted stuns. And then what? He prob retreaded to his like t4s

@direwold yea but thats implying a sniper doesnt use his range advantage. He can stay like way behind his barrax and still attack enemy who are on t3s. No one can blink initiate that long, thats why i said, i think clock is his biggest counter very late. + he has shrapnel

Medusa, Slark, PL, 6 slotted Shadow Fiend 30 min in the game, Riki ia also tricky offlane if he's 6 sloted.

Ember is also scary.

Edit

Btw, Tiny can rape Slark even with 2x Shadow Dance if you go like abysal/hex/refresher on him. But it can go both ways.

And you won't build tiny this way, so.. yeah.. slark is pretty op

This thread is pointless. There are counters to every hero so you cannot say one carry is the best without specifying the heroes on both teams. Medusa gets destroyed by manaburn, slark gets shut down by aoe disable, naga gets countered by deathball, etc. etc.

@minglee
yeah bro in 3k bracket ember players always go mid they get double battlefury desolator malestrom they never split push with boost of travel cuz they got phase boots and they never buy boots of travel till they get 6 slot then they get travel because they there is nothing else to buy instead boots of travel they never get linken manta or even rapier because they are pu$sy they get 3x daedalus + 2 battlefury and boot instead rapier . blink dagger is like the most retard item on ember to them so they always jump in team fights with ultimate and 100% times they get caught by stun or silence or an abyssal on pa and 1 crit dead
they just use sof on the first hero they saw so yes they are useless for 6 sec and they probably miss the 2nd sof on the wrong target if they survive to use sof for second time they never have a fire remnant at a safe place so they can escape quickly they try to escape by using fire remnant multiple time when u gank on them but the funniest thing is when u jump on them with invoker and ice wall them and then u see them trying to escape by fire remnant but they dont know when they are on ice wall fire remnant actually moving slower that themselves
plus their team never know to get linken for him even after 50 minute
u should never expect them to know how to chain a single target by sof then chain they always use chain before sof or when sof is finished

assuming the player is perfect i would say naga unless u have specific counters
anyway the condition was win not win a 1v1 fight

@RedRover ' This thread is pointless '
are u serious ? every thing on dotabuff is useless unless its lmao shit.kappa

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As a Support Hero, the role you play within your team comes with a set of specific items. To determine what these are consider the following two premises:

Limited Income: There are certain heroes who need gold to buy items to be strong for the team in the lategame. These heroes are known as carries. They will try to last hit as many creeps as they can to maximize their income, and spend their money on items that increase their stats and thereby their damage output or survivability. As a consequence, the team, and you as a support hero, will allow them to get these last hits - resulting in few last hits, and little income, for you. This isn't a problem - as a support hero you rely more on your spells and abilities than items.

Limited Item Slots: Every hero in Dota 2 can carry six items. Consider that two of these will be occupied by Town Portal Scrolls and Boots, making the remaining four a valuable commodity. As the aforementioned carries will want to stack those four slots with start-increasing goodies, it comes to the supports to carry items that are good for the team.

For instance, a Buckler can be built step-by-step through three low-cost items (Chainmail 550, Iron Branch 53, Recipe 200 - Total: 803) and the stat increase that it gives its bearer are decent, but not enough to warrant a quarter of your carry's slots. However, it's active ability, Armor Bonus, can give the whole team a +2 armor buff, making it an excellent item for the team as a whole. It therefore falls to the support heroes to build, hold, and operate an item like this.

Survivability[edit]

· · ·

Regeneration items (or 'regen items') are must-buys for almost any hero. Having these on you enables you to stay in your lane longer and continue to get exp and gold that you would miss out on if you had to walk back to the fountain. Buying regen items as a support hero is even more important, as these items can also be shared: they can be given from one hero to another and the latter will be able to use them. If one of your items can keep alive the hero you're supporting, while he saves some money and gets to his goal item a bit faster, that's often worth the cost of that item.Clarities ensure a healthy batch of mana which is similarly important. Your stun or heal can secure that gank or save your buddy's life. A good item to pick up a bit later in the game is a Magic Wand. It's very buildable through some cheap items, and will add decently to your survivability.

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Note: Some heroes like Lich, Lion and Keeper of the Light don't really need clarities as they have other means of regaining mana.

Vision[edit]

· ·

Items that give either vision or reveal invisible units benefit the team as a whole. Because of limited slots and limited income though, it falls to the support heroes to buy these items and place them.

Observer wards are staple for any game. Keeping an eye on runes or keeping you safe from surprise attacks benefits everyone. To read more, see warding.

The need for Sentry Ward and Dust of Appearance really depends on your opponent. Do they have any heroes that have the ability to become invisible? Have any of them picked up a Shadow Blade? When such is the case, make sure to invest in, and utilize, these helpful items.

Couriers and Town Portals[edit]

· ·

Walking is the bane of any experience- and gold-loving DotA hero. When you're walking you're not getting either of these so if it's at all possible we'd like to avoid any walking at all times. Every team therefore wants an Animal Courier. Since it benefits the team as a whole, the support hero usually makes the investment. When the times comes to upgrade it to a Flying Courier, that also falls to the supports.

Another thing that we don't like about walking is that it takes so long. As the game progresses into a phase where your and the opposing team are trying more in the ways of tower pushing and ganking heroes, you need to pick up some Town Portal Scrolls for instant-mobility. When Tower A needs defending, you can TP in to help, leaving your carry to gain all the experience in his lane near Tower B. Similarly, when your team decides to make a move, and has need of your ganking skills, you can instantly TP in and help them.

Team Items[edit]

As alluded to in the intro, there are a good number of items that have an effect on the team as a whole. They have some kind of aura, or an active ability that helps all surrounding heroes. What's more, their recipes or builds are usually very affordable for a support's kind of income. Staple examples of such items are Arcane Boots, which restore 135 mana to the surrounding heroes when used - and Mekansm, which has an aura that gives +4 HP regenation bonus to surrounding allies, as well as an active ability that instantly restores 250 HP to surrounding allies plus gives them a +2 armor bonus.

Basic Stats[edit]

· · ·

To gain stats use usually build the cheaper items with the more affordable, several-cheap-items-requiring, recipes. For this purpose, Iron Branches are the best item in the game, with a great cost-benefit ratio. They can also be built into a Magic Wand or a Mekansm later on. Other than that, look for Gauntlets, Slippers, Mantles, Bracers, Wraith Bands and Null Talismans.

Late Game[edit]

As a support hero, you are not very dependent on items, and your income won't really be high enough to buy any of the bigger items. Your income will mainly keep going towards Wards and Town Portals. If however you do manage to get a decent bank, here are some suggestions. Please note that many item buys in this phase of the game are very hero-dependent.

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Mana regen - As a support, you're often dependent on your spells working to their best effect so buying items to enlarge your manapool or increase your mana regen are good options. Think Sage's Masks, Void Stones, Energy Boosters or items that give you an intelligence bonus. A Bloodstone becomes particularly attractive for heroes like Leshrac and Witch Doctor whose spells burn mana really fast.

Disablers - Items that have an active spell that disables an enemy hero are usually carried by supports once they can afford them - in teamfights, your main role is to disable anyway. Some of these items, like Eul's Scepter of Divinity and Rod of Atos have very affordable building routes, requiring no super expensive items along the way.

Aghanim's Scepter - Scepter has an effect on a lot of heroes' ult. Make sure to check if this applies to the hero you're playing. If so, it's usually an item worth building towards. On route you can pick up a Point Booster, which gives you more mana and survivability, and an Ogre Club for even more HP. You need a decent income for this though

Mobility - Boots of Speed are always important for a support, but depending on your hero you can try to farm a Blink Dagger. They're not for everyone, but initiating support heroes like Tidehunter and Earthshaker greatly benefit from being able to blink into the enemy. Alternatively, consider a Force Staff. It is affordable, and gives you a decent Int bonus plus some health regen, but the real benefit is that you can use is active to help your allies engage or flee more effectively.

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References[edit]

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• Largely adapted from (Guide) How to play support by BurningSera by BurningSera.